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an old but interesting article


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    • #100
      Robert
      Participant

        Here is an old article, some of you might find it interesting.

        http://www.gundogmag.com/breeds/gundog_breeds_setter_062104/

      • #167
        October Setters
        Keymaster

          Well, interesting in as much as it reiterates all the old misconceptions about what a “Ryman setter” was.  It demonstrates just how far off most people’s idea of a Ryman setter was, and in some cases still is.  John Taylor got so much wrong it’s hard to know where to begin – the entire history of the breed (show and field trials), dates, timelines, ownership of dogs, even that there never were “dual setters” as they are portrayed in the article.  You need look no further than the first photo in the article.  The caption reads “Sir Roger DeCoverly, the scion of the Ryman and DeCoverly English setter lines.”  There are two minor problems with that.  First George Ryman never bred to Sir Roger DeCoverly, the supposed fountainhead of the Ryman “line”.  Second, the dog in the photo is NOT Sir Roger DeCoverly. 

          Cliff

        • #168
          Robert
          Participant

            What also got me, I have heard when Ellen took over the line degenerated from what Mr. Ryman had, but according to this it was the opposite. I know Ken Alexander is thought of to have been the one who carried on Rymans vision, but he did not meet them till 13 years after Mr. Rymans stroke and 7 years after his death. So the dogs he was seeing were Ellens vision, not George’s. I have always believed that decoverly kennels was never based on George Rymans vision, maybe that is why the new owner bred to shadow oak Bo.

          • #169
            October Setters
            Keymaster

              “So the dogs he was seeing were Ellens vision, not George’s.”
              That’s right.  Actually it was probably Carl Calkins’ vision.  I don’t get the idea Ellen ever had much input into the actual breeding decisions, despite what you might hear.  Whoever was responsible, Ellen or Carl, the dogs and the breeding program changed significantly after Ryman’s death. 

              “I have
              always believed that decoverly kennels was never based on George Rymans
              vision, maybe that is why the new owner bred to shadow oak Bo”

              Maybe it’s because crossing with show dogs produced dogs that needed a boost in the drive/hunting instinct department?

              Cliff

            • #170

              Thanks for posting this, Robert.  I think that in informing and educating the public it is as important to point out what is not true about ryman-types as it is to share facts and truths.   I have had ryman-types for only 20+ years but have heard a pretty amazing variety of stories and tales about rymans and their history, many from folks who claim to have been there and been part of it all.   It’s funny how facts are little details that get in the way of many of those “story” tales.  All of this highlights how important this website is to ryman-type setters and that each member here carries responsibility for their future.

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